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Reseller refuses to provide sufficient details to do "Ownership Transfer" of Dell laptop warranty

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ZaLiTHkA

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Location
Merrivale, KZN
Deal Thread URL: https://carbonite.co.za/index.php?threads/dell-latitude-i5-12th-gen.502006/
Seller:
@PCS SALE
Buyer: @ZaLiTHkA
Description of Bad Deal:
I take absolutely no pleasure in doing this, and in all my years on this forum, I've never felt the need to.. until now. The seller and I have gone back and forth a number of times regarding this now, and it's getting me absolutely nowhere.

To provide some context for this, I would like to list a few critical points from the laptop ad thread that relate to my complaint:
  • Age: 2 months old
  • Warranty: SEP 2025
  • Warranty Holder: Dell
  • Packaging: Can be packaged
  • Condition: Very Minor Marks
  • Accessories: Original Dell Charger

I messaged the seller on the 8th of October to express an interest, and we moved the conversation to WhatsApp as it makes things much easier all round. I requested photos of the laptop, which were provided, I was happy with what saw and I agreed to purchase it.

We decided on PostNet for delivery, as it needed to move from Pretoria (GP) to Merrivale (KZN), insuring the contents to a value of R9000 with PostNet, on account of not having the original packaging.

I then collected the laptop from PostNet during my lunchtime on the 13th of October, and it sat in my car until I got home that evening. The laptop itself was a gift for my mother, and so I did not open the packaging myself, instead letting her do that (it was a gift, you don't open somebody else gift).

Late afternoon, I took the package around to my mother and presented the gift. Upon opening it, we discovered that while the charger was there, the clover power cable for it was missing. I messaged the seller immediately to query this, and he passed it off as "I had some package it they must have forgotten a power cable". This was not a deal breaker, we found an appropriate cable to use temporarily, just to get things up and running.

We then discovered that Windows 10 Pro (21H1) had been loaded onto the laptop with absolutely no drivers, no LAN, no WiFi, nothing. Which also meant we couldn't just connect to our local network and install said missing drivers.

Personal Disclaimer: I was having a pretty crappy day all round, and this was just the last straw for me.. I suspected that the charging port on the laptop itself was damaged, so in combination with everything else, at this point I insisted on a refund.

The seller then kept making suggestions of "I'll send you a cable", and "can you maybe find one at a local shop", and "it's just missing drivers", etc.. At this point, I took the laptop home with me to attempt to sort out the driver story, which I did by means of USB to transfer WiFi drivers, and then everything else was done through Windows Update. All devices installed with no issues, software and hardware all good to go. While doing so, I worked that the charging problem was not actually the port on the laptop, but rather that the USB-C plug on the charger itself was damaged. Searching online I found replacement chargers to be about R1k.

I messaged the seller early morning on the 14th to apologize and inform him that I did manage to get the driver issue resolved. I also queried some light spots that I noticed on the laptop screen, which I only noticed because I was using it in the dark. At this point I needed to present a case to my mother and see if she was happy to keep the laptop, or if I should find something else for her.

Later on that day, I confirmed with the seller that the issues were nominal and that we're happy to keep the laptop, no need for any refund.

On the 15th of October we tried to go through Dell "Ownership Transfer" process, so that we could actually get access to the warranty through Dell. I requested some basic info from the seller in order to do this, and he avoided the question, instead asking for it's service tag.

I provided the service tag as requested, and then he sent screenshots of a form from the Dell website with a message that read "Please provide this" with absolutely no context of what the form was or why he wanted it. After getting clarification, I provided the requested details.

After this, I discovered that Dell do not allow anybody other than the new owner to perform this process. So on the 16th of October, I tried to phone the seller hoping to get this resolved, as I thought that would be quicker and easier than the messages back and forth. Ultimately that phone call did not achieve much of anything, other than the fact that I finally got an invoice for the purchase, after both having the seller offer to send an invoice three times and myself having requested it twice (I think?). FWIW, the date on the invoice was not the date of my purchase, so this was only created after-the-fact.

This morning, on the 19th of October, my mother received an email update from Dell with the following message:
Previous owner information provided in the request is not valid for asset provided. Please contact your seller or your Dell sales representative.

I then messaged the seller to explain what had happened, and again request some basic information in order to do Dell's "Ownership Transfer" process, this time including a URL to Dell's website where they state in no uncertain terms that this cannot be done by a reseller on behalf of a client.

And at this point I'm actually just going to drop our WhatsApp conversation from today in this post directly, as it explains my problems here way more clearly than any summary or paraphrasing I could ever give:
19/10/2023, 11:44 - Dre: Dell responded to the request to transfer ownership of this laptop, it was denied with the following reason:

"Previous owner information provided in the request is not valid for asset provided. Please contact your seller or your Dell sales representative."

So, who actually owned this laptop before you sold it? <This message was edited>
19/10/2023, 11:45 - PCS Sales: Hi

Am a middle man seller
I sell for companies that have bulk laptops

I find buyers specifically I don’t know who registered under their name before
19/10/2023, 11:46 - PCS Sales: You can return the laptop and I’ll refund hence it’s been giving us issues one after another
19/10/2023, 11:46 - Dre: Then stop telling people in your ads that they have warranties, that's an outright lie.
19/10/2023, 11:47 - PCS Sales: When someone has a problem with the laptop I help out
I don’t ignore
19/10/2023, 11:47 - PCS Sales: As you can see am helping you out
19/10/2023, 11:50 - PCS Sales: Honestly am not selling laptop for personal gain, my mom has breast cancer and am paying all her hospital bills

That’s why am working and doing business at the same time

And I try my best to leave the customer satisfied even if it means refund so I can grow the business to be able to handle my bills
19/10/2023, 11:52 - Dre: So you're telling me that you buy and resell laptops (probably other things as well), without keeping any record of where it came from?

Then you will try and claim that it has a valid warranty, even though you yourself have just admitted that you have no way of proving that?
19/10/2023, 11:56 - PCS Sales: I resell for companies
A company may have 10x 5430s instock that it wants to sell

I find a buyer add R1000 to R1500 as profit
19/10/2023, 11:57 - Dre: Ok, so please give me the company name that *this* laptop came from, so that we can do the transfer of ownership.
19/10/2023, 11:59 - PCS Sales: That’s another phase, will have to contact company and go through it and all of that and if the transfer fails again it’s another issue

That’s why I simply suggested you return and I refund

I don’t think you happy with this laptop and the transaction
19/10/2023, 12:00 - Dre: All I need is the company name, they don't need to get involved for any of this.
19/10/2023, 12:01 - Dre: Specifically the name of the company that originally registered as the device owner. <This message was edited>
19/10/2023, 12:07 - PCS Sales: Am not quite sure I’d like to let go of my suppliers details like that

It’s best you purchase a laptop you’ll be happy with

Am wrong for selling you a incompetent product
19/10/2023, 12:07 - PCS Sales: I have to get back to work
My response may be a bit slower
19/10/2023, 12:10 - Dre: As per this Dell Support KB article: Ownership Transfer and Dell Product Registration Guides | Dell South Africa

Transfer of ownership can only be done by the new owner and will only be allowed if sufficient information is provided for the previous owner.

That "sufficient information" is literally nothing more than a business name and postal code.
19/10/2023, 12:27 - PCS Sales: I’ll check
But I see it simpler for both of us if we reverse the transaction
Cause if the transfer fails again
Back to square one
19/10/2023, 12:31 - PCS Sales: Another simplification
I can send you another invoice stating 2 years of warranty from my company

When you face issues you’ll contact me

So in short, this guys is selling Dell laptops, claiming that they have a warranty with Dell, but then refusing to provide the necessary details for the buyer to access said warranty, instead resorting to offering a warranty from his little shop instead...? Surely the Carbonite community would never condone behaviour like this from somebody sporting a nice bright yellow "Reseller" tag?

I have exported our WhatsApp conversation and uploaded it with all attachments to a folder in my Google Drive. I do not feel comfortable sharing it with anyone and everyone that passes by, as it does contain a great deal of personal information, but I am willing to share a link with forum moderators on request.



Regardless of the purchase price, this is not what one expects when buying a 2 month old laptop where the only issue disclosed ahead of time was "minor scratches"... I just can't wrap my head around how someone can do business like this and still sleep soundly at night.

In closing, I must be clear: we are keeping this Dell laptop, regardless of whether or not we manage to get access to it's warranty. Simply because it honestly is a good deal at this price, even with having to replace the charger ourselves.
 
Because the laptop belonged to a company a warranty claim will be difficult if you don't know the company name, transfer of warranty isn't really needed as they will still honor the warranty, if you know the company name.
 
Because the laptop belonged to a company a warranty claim will be difficult if you don't know the company name, transfer of warranty isn't really needed as they will still honor the warranty, if you know the company name.
I'm not sure I understand what you mean here.. Wouldn't any warranty backed by Dell be tied to the "Dell ProSupport" plan linked to the service tag? Or is the manufacturer warranty not part of that plan?

I've never needed to deal with Dell Support personally, but my brother (network admin of 20+ years) has numerous times, both for individuals and businesses, and as far as I understand Dell will refuse support outright unless the person requesting it can prove ownership of the "asset" (as per their terminology).

Point is, the laptop was advertised as coming with a manufacturer warranty, and I cannot see any way to get access to that if we ever do need to.
 
I'm not sure I understand what you mean here.. Wouldn't any warranty backed by Dell be tied to the "Dell ProSupport" plan linked to the service tag? Or is the manufacturer warranty not part of that plan?

I've never needed to deal with Dell Support personally, but my brother (network admin of 20+ years) has numerous times, both for individuals and businesses, and as far as I understand Dell will refuse support outright unless the person requesting it can prove ownership of the "asset" (as per their terminology).

Point is, the laptop was advertised as coming with a manufacturer warranty, and I cannot see any way to get access to that if we ever do need to.
Every time I dealt with Dell they merely asked for the service tag after I provided and it is still under warranty with Dell warranty they would honor it without proof of purchase. Only when it was purchased under a business you would need to provide the business name otherwise they refuse.

But it also depends on who you speak to at Dell, sometimes they would send out a tech without the business name.
 
If the laptop has Dell Prosupport with it they honor the warranty regardless is my experience with it. They could ask you a few different question service tag aswell as a potential picture of the charger etc. Normally you just log a ticket. They come out and fix it no questions asked. That is just my experience with it have done it probably 4 or 5 times assisting people i know.
 
2c here.

I work at a company and we have only dell machines. I log calls for them via the dell site and was never one asked to prove ownership.
I have logged 105 service requests so far, no refusals.

So don't fret too much. They will honor the warranty.
 
2c here.

I work at a company and we have only dell machines. I log calls for them via the dell site and was never one asked to prove ownership.
I have logged 105 service requests so far, no refusals.

So don't fret too much. They will honor the warranty.
thank you, that is good to know..
 
As far as I am aware no reply from the accused here violates the rules? Unless you have been dealing in DM
 
As far as I am aware no reply from the accused here violates the rules? Unless you have been dealing in DM
that would be correct, as per the "Bad Deals" rules.. he technically had one week to respond.

I did receive a WhatsApp message from the seller on 23rd October, yet again offering a refund on the laptop. but just to confirm, I have not received any further messages from him, either on WhatsApp or here on Carbonite.

I've honestly lost track of how many times I've had to point out that (a) doing so would not resolve anything and (b) we are actually happy with the laptop itself and would prefer to keep it.

really regretting still leaving positive feedback on my deal now... I almost selected "neutral", but changed my mind at the last moment because, well, it is still a good deal considering the caliber of laptop involved here.
 
A
that would be correct, as per the "Bad Deals" rules.. he technically had one week to respond.

I did receive a WhatsApp message from the seller on 23rd October, yet again offering a refund on the laptop. but just to confirm, I have not received any further messages from him, either on WhatsApp or here on Carbonite.

I've honestly lost track of how many times I've had to point out that (a) doing so would not resolve anything and (b) we are actually happy with the laptop itself and would prefer to keep it.

really regretting still leaving positive feedback on my deal now... I almost selected "neutral", but changed my mind at the last moment because, well, it is still a good deal considering the caliber of laptop involved here.
Well just change your feedback.
 
A

Well just change your feedback.
as far as I know, that's not possible.. I don't see any "edit" or "delete" options there.

my feedback message does highlight the initial issues with the deal though, so the appropriate information is there.. unfortunately most would-be-buyers will look at the overall ratings for a seller, but not always go to read the feedback itself, especially if it's all marked as "positive".

unless perhaps a forum mod would be able to unlock and/or delete that feedback entry for me?
 
as far as I know, that's not possible.. I don't see any "edit" or "delete" options there.

my feedback message does highlight the initial issues with the deal though, so the appropriate information is there.. unfortunately most would-be-buyers will look at the overall ratings for a seller, but not always go to read the feedback itself, especially if it's all marked as "positive".

unless perhaps a forum mod would be able to unlock and/or delete that feedback entry for me?
You have to report the feedback, and let the mods know you'd like to change it to neutral/negative
CLicky that flag looking thing, on your feedback you left for the seller.

 
as far as I know, that's not possible.. I don't see any "edit" or "delete" options there.

my feedback message does highlight the initial issues with the deal though, so the appropriate information is there.. unfortunately most would-be-buyers will look at the overall ratings for a seller, but not always go to read the feedback itself, especially if it's all marked as "positive".

unless perhaps a forum mod would be able to unlock and/or delete that feedback entry for me?
please change it to neutral, ask mods to do it, the fact that you had to open a deal threads to even resolve is already uncomfortable,
if something went wrong and the dude sorted it out immediately than its a positive experience, the fact that we are 3 to 4 weeks in, close to border line negative itrader, never mind neutral. you are too patient.
 
well, it is still a good deal considering the caliber of laptop involved here.
Often when something’s too good to be true, it…..

In this case, it’s a 2 month old relatively high end laptop for about a third of the retail price. I would definitely query the origin of such great deals as @Toxxyc is doing, else you / your mum end up with issues later on when the original owners find out you have it.
 
@Toxxyc
Hi there, apologies for no response, as it seems I have been involved in a deal of which a buyer was not satisfied, I couldn’t provide details cause I struggled to receive them from my suppliers end… so to solve the matter I countlessly asked my buyer to return the laptop and I’ll give him a refund. I’ve never ignored him on WhatsApp or ran away from him even when I was busy. You can ask him… I’ve asked multiple times before for him to just return the laptop and take his refund and, as he says he has our WhatsApp text… in them it shows how I’ve asked to refund and how apologetic I was for the misunderstanding. It was a genuine mistake and I asked him to return the laptop and get his full refund… he has the chats and I have the chats to back that.
 
@Toxxyc
The last message I sent to him on WhatsApp 23 October he never responded. In the message I clearly stated that since he is still not happy with the deal he can return the laptop.

Am I wrong for refunding him and rectifying a genuine mistake ?
 
It is imperative that you as a supplier (@PCS SALE) vet the source of what you are selling. If you are inadvertently dealing in stolen goods, there are massive implications. Laptops can be tracked to their locations of use.

The unsuspecting buyer could land up in jail when the police/investigating agency lands up on his doorstep. You could land up in jail when the buyer refers them to you.

@ZaLiTHkA I hope you have all the seller's details on record including an invoice for purchase should the above happen.

The above happened to me when I bought a secondhand laptop on Carb some years ago and they wanted to lock me up straight away with no discussions. Luckily, I knew the chap from the security firm who tracked the laptop.
 
@PCS SALE you can ask for a refund, but the guy has a right to keep what he purchased. It's his. And you're within the requirements to provide him the info he needs.

I've told you before, and I'm telling you know again. Make sure you know where your goods are from. You sold counterfeit SSDs on here before, and your laptops you say you have no idea where they're from. If a single one comes back stolen, you need to know SAPS is going to come knocking on your door.

This is your last warning on the matter.
 
Hi all, apologies.. catching up on a few messages here, I'm having one crazy week.

Often when something’s too good to be true, it…..

In this case, it’s a 2 month old relatively high end laptop for about a third of the retail price. I would definitely query the origin of such great deals as @Toxxyc is doing, else you / your mum end up with issues later on when the original owners find out you have it.
yeah, that did cross my mind.. the seller's all positive feedback rating was the deciding factor in this case.

It is imperative that you as a supplier (@PCS SALE) vet the source of what you are selling. If you are inadvertently dealing in stolen goods, there are massive implications. Laptops can be tracked to their locations of use.

The unsuspecting buyer could land up in jail when the police/investigating agency lands up on his doorstep. You could land up in jail when the buyer refers them to you.
that is a rather scary thought, to be honest.. but I see your point.

@ZaLiTHkA I hope you have all the seller's details on record including an invoice for purchase should the above happen.

The above happened to me when I bought a secondhand laptop on Carb some years ago and they wanted to lock me up straight away with no discussions. Luckily, I knew the chap from the security firm who tracked the laptop.
and yes, I did eventually get an invoice, dated 16th October with a note in the footer that reads "laptop already paid for on 08/10/2023". it does have the wrong address though, he used my name (because I paid for it) but then my mom's physical address (I guess because she's the new owner? who knows..).

@Toxxyc
Hi there, apologies for no response, as it seems I have been involved in a deal of which a buyer was not satisfied, I couldn’t provide details cause I struggled to receive them from my suppliers end… so to solve the matter I countlessly asked my buyer to return the laptop and I’ll give him a refund. I’ve never ignored him on WhatsApp or ran away from him even when I was busy. You can ask him… I’ve asked multiple times before for him to just return the laptop and take his refund and, as he says he has our WhatsApp text… in them it shows how I’ve asked to refund and how apologetic I was for the misunderstanding. It was a genuine mistake and I asked him to return the laptop and get his full refund… he has the chats and I have the chats to back that.
the emphasized part in this message was never portrayed to me... so I'm calling bullshit here.

15th Oct was my first request for the name of the original owner, which the only response was two screenshots of a website data capture form and a message that read "Please provide this".

then we got an email response from Dell on the 19th which stated "Previous owner information provided in the request is not valid for asset provided. Please contact your seller or your Dell sales representative". when I queried this with the seller, hos response was, and I quote:
Hi

Am a middle man seller
I sell for companies that have bulk laptops

I find buyers specifically I don’t know who registered under their name before

I wasn't happy with that reason, so I pressed the matter further and got the following response:
Am not quite sure I’d like to let go of my suppliers details like that

followed shortly by:
Another simplification
I can send you another invoice stating 2 years of warranty from my company

When you face issues you’ll contact me

so yeah, it feels like this guy has nothing but excuses, and he can't even keep those stories straight.
 
Middle manning is not a bad thing, but having sketchy suppliers is another matter entirely. I understand not wanting to totally divulge the supplier's details as then you could cut out the middle man and go directly there, but in this case if the warranty is registered with Dell legitimately, you should be able to do a transfer of ownership.

I think what the seller is saying is that he will warrant the laptop for you for the rest of the warranty period, and you could send it to him should you need to make a claim. If I am understanding correctly
 
Middle manning is not a bad thing, but having sketchy suppliers is another matter entirely. I understand not wanting to totally divulge the supplier's details as then you could cut out the middle man and go directly there, but in this case if the warranty is registered with Dell legitimately, you should be able to do a transfer of ownership.

I think what the seller is saying is that he will warrant the laptop for you for the rest of the warranty period, and you could send it to him should you need to make a claim. If I am understanding correctly
I hear what you're saying, and I don't disagree with the sentiment.. at the same time though, I must say that none of our conversations regarding this gave me that impression.

2c here.

I work at a company and we have only dell machines. I log calls for them via the dell site and was never one asked to prove ownership.
I have logged 105 service requests so far, no refusals.

So don't fret too much. They will honor the warranty.
also, just a quick follow up on this one.. I don't think this would actually be the case after all, at least not based on the reading I've done on Dell's community forums.

there are many, many, many entries (17200-odd, according to their search results) regarding queries about getting access to Dell's warranty and support services... I've read through a number of them now, and this comment by "ejn63" stood out to me:

No, you simply need the information from your seller. The warranty applies only to the original purchaser until you transfer it with Dell. The matter is in the hands of your seller. As above, if they cannot or will not assist, return the system to them for a refund. Simple as that.

which was then confirmed by the Dell Community Manager himself:

The agents response was correct and in line with Dell policy. This Latitude 7200 2-in-1 was originally sold 2 years/5 months/1 day ago on February 19, 2020 to a Federal customer in the USA. That is the last record we have for this laptop. How it got to Ukraine we cannot know nor can we know who sold it to you. The seller in Ukraine would have to provide the refund, not Dell USA.

NOTE: yes, I do see the suggestion of returning it to the seller, and yes I know that was offered (7 times now, if I'm counting correctly).. but as I've stated, doing that will not fix the problem. it will simply shift it onto the next buyer, and I would have done nothing but help perpetuate the issue.

the laptop has a new home, it's happy there. this is a question of core principles and business ethics.
 
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