FIBRE Deep Dive

[MidnightWizard]

Greetings All

Due to our Telkom copper being cut for the second time by "saboteurs" I am forced to look at getting fibre
We have both a Telkom and Vodacom LTE sim card deals but in our area LTE is not even a replacement for ADSL ( too slow )
I am interested in the detailed technical specs of how fibre is provided in SA ( I know the basics )
I am looking for stuff like what an ONT does and how it is used by the NO / ISP ( Does it have a MaC address ? / Is it configurable ?
Does anyone have an ONT for sale preferably one of the stand alone units ( NOKIA ) - not one of the - all-in-one units that is also a WiFi router
As I understand the ONT is really just a transceiver - converts optical signals ( light ) to electrical signals ( Ethernet )
I am also investigating the use of GPON SFP's to do away with the need for an ONT
Not sure if this can be done ? but if it can be I think I might have the equipment to make us of this method ?

 

[Kamikaze]

I can't comment on the intricacies of how fibre is set up, but I do have a Nokia ONT available if you're interested - https://carbonite.co.za/index.php?threads/nokia-g-240w-c-router-nokia-g-240g-c-ont.482042/

 

[MakeMemesDreams]

you find out who the fno in your area is, the check their isps that they serve. no need to buy an ont, most will give you one free to use. most will also give you a wifi router free to use

 

[MidnightWizard]

I can't comment on the intricacies of how fibre is set up, but I do have a Nokia ONT available if you're interested - https://carbonite.co.za/index.php?threads/nokia-g-240w-c-router-nokia-g-240g-c-ont.482042/

Aaahhh OK
R10.00 off for every "bump" ? lol
I gather you are leaving SA ? = EMMIGRATION ?

 

[Metalspawn]

Find out who your FNO is, the ONT is really key to going from GPON to Ethernet. GPON is 2.5Gbps down and 1.25Gbps up (thus its not the normal 1 or 10G ethernet we use is "normal" networking.

But this really depends on your FNO. To give you an example (I worked in this space), the ONT at Openserve at least gives you an ID in the network (double tagged VLAN). Without this, nothing will work and traffic will be dropped. The ONT also chats to the OLT (where all the ONTs connect to) - This is typically vendor specific - Cannot connect Huawei ONT to Nokia OLT.

That also being said, the ONT is property of the service provider, so I don't think you can sell it or buy it from someone else, I might be wrong here but highly doubt it.

In some of the other threads discussing this, the service was provided as active ethernet (normal 1G service using a SFP) - Here you have a good chance to skip the ONT. If its GPON, forget it.

 

[Kamikaze]

Aaahhh OK
R10.00 off for every "bump" ? lol
I gather you are leaving SA ? = EMMIGRATION ?

Haha! It's a friend's ONT who left SA earlier this year. PM me and we can negotiate a little, should you want to go down this router

Emmigration/Immigration... ehh... I couldn't be bothered to know which is which.

 

[MidnightWizard]

you find out who the fno in your area is, the check their isps that they serve. no need to buy an ont, most will give you one free to use. most will also give you a wifi router free to use

Yes thanks
I have been told by Telkom technicians that it is the FNO in our area that is cutting Telkom copper cable - note NOT stealing cable just cutting it !
Most new installs they will provide an ONT / NTU and "free" router - not so wise to try and hack those ?
Prefer to "self-provision" if possible

 

[Metalspawn]

Also adding, I have not seen any SP sell GPON capable SFPs to end customers (and skipping the ONT). They do exist however. The ONT is where they can monitor to make sure connectivity goes all the way to the house - Without this is becomes difficult to troubleshoot.

If I were a SP providing GPON, I would mandate to put something down at the house to monitor. Then you know the fiber is working all the way to the house and the problem is on customers router. Or Fiber is down (and not a problem with customer router)

 

[MidnightWizard]

Thanks
Part of the question was what the ISP / FNO do to monitor the connection ?
What are they able to access - what do they access ?
What are the technical details of this access ?

I guess a good old fashioned ping would not be sufficient ?
I would think that a proper GPON SFP would have the necessary ability to provide the information the ISP / FNO would require ?

Cisco GPON SFP

 

[IOPS]

You can't provide your own ONT, your ISP provisons one and has the FNO install it. Nokia most likely for OpenServe installations.
It cannot be configured.

Fibre terminates to your ONT, you can plug in whatever router via Ethernet from there.

I'm not following your questions about what/how the ISP "monitors" your connection. They have a suite, typically an API integration with the FNO to run certain diagnostics. Monitoring beyond that happens at a network level. If you're concerned about your privacy, run DNS over HTTPS and don't use the DHCP assigned DNS servers.

OpenServe typically auth via PPPoE, this may depend on the ISP you sign up with though.

 

[MidnightWizard]

I'm not following your questions about what/how the ISP "monitors" your connection. They have a suite, typically an API integration with the FNO to run certain diagnostics. Monitoring beyond that happens at a network level. If you're concerned about your privacy, run DNS over HTTPS and don't use the DHCP assigned DNS servers.

OpenServe typically auth via PPPoE, this may depend on the ISP you sign up with though.

Thanks
Sounds a lot like the old days of ISDN - where Telkom provided a similar sort of CPE

I am interested in the full details of how fibre ( GPON ) is provided in SA
Unfortunately in this country it appears everything is "secret" / "proprietary" / "not-configurable" .....
Not a problem in other countries where they WANT you to learn ...

FOA Online Reference Guide

FOA Self Study

Fiber Optic Association Fiber To The Home Handbook


Some days when I see how things are done in other - more advanced countries compared to SA my despair and frustration overcome me !

 

[IOPS]

What would you want to configure on the ONT, for example?
Some systems are proprietary, sure. But nothing is stopping you from learning about fibre networks.

 

[Metalspawn]

I am interested in the full details of how fibre ( GPON ) is provided in SA:

FNOs provide L2 for ISPs that do the L3 portion.

Fiber is run by FNOs and OLT and ONTs are provided by said FNOs. They monitor the physical fiber levels, connection etc (On L1 and some L2). This is not a ping test, its in-band communication between ONT and OLT. This is the main reason why ONT and OLT needs to be of the same brand, there are open standards but why bother if you know brand A and brand A works perfectly together. They do not monitor L3. This is where the FNOs responsibility stops (see demarcation point)

The OLT then says okay user 1 is with ISP 1, so I am bridging his traffic to VLAN 1 (which is sent to ISP1), user 2 ISP 2 on VLAN 2 for example.

Then if you are on ISP 1, you traffic gets bridged to ISP 1 and you either PPPOE dial in, or just grab an IP from DHCP, depending on the deployment. The ISP then can monitor the CPE (router), but they don't always do this and sometime allow 3rd party devices (your own router).

For reference I am with metro fiber and use my own untangle server (CPE) to do PPPOE - Works great. I did have to ask my ISP Mind the speed however.

FNO = Pipe to ISP
ISP = L3 routing

There will always be a need for an ONT on a GPON network. If might be the Cisco one as you mentioned (where the logic sits on the SFP level), but most users don't have Routers that can take SFPs, so they place the box with GPON one side, and RJ45 ethernet on the other so that pretty much anyone can connect to them.

@MidnightWizard I am not sure if anything from the above is unclear? Perhaps you can elaborate on what's missing.

You have still not disclosed who your FNO is and what access technology they are using, so you are getting disgruntled at something and we don't even know who or what it is...