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So AMD Ryzen 2 is coming shortly but what is Intel's answer?

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#1
So I see the pricings are out for the AMDs and they can now be ordered already, this is a bold move yet again by AMD but they really are taking the fight to Intel. I used to be an AMD fanboy back in the day but got tired of all the overclocking hype without the true performance to back their claims up. So when Ryzen launched I went 8700k.

My question is do Intel do something unexpected now and release a better CPU that is compatible with current boards, if so that would be epic and I'd be first in line for a newer bad boy
 

Gouhan

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#2
They do nothing. Releasing a new CPU even a SKU based on existing CPUs takes a bit of effort. Countering the competition in such a manner hasn't taken place in decades as it simply isn't cost effective.
INTEL's next announcement outside of the 8086K is towards Q3 even Q4 of this year with Z390 and 8 core CPUs for desktop.
In fact, 2nd Generation ThreadRipper should be out before INTEL's next announcement.
 
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#3
Gouhan Gouhan thank you buddy, I just thought there'd be more of a competition based on Intels sloppy release of the 8700k which wasn't due to be out yet but Ryzen brought about it's premature release many said hence the heating issues for some out of the box.

Will Intel be releasing an upgrade to the 8700k like an 8800k or something which justifies an upgrade?
 
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#4
I bought the 8600k after owning the 1800X and boy its alot faster, the benchmarks i've seen thus far the 2700x has an avarge of like 3fps above the 8600k. and its way more expensive
AMD-Ryzen-7-2700X-Juegos-4K-01.jpg
 

Gouhan

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#6
Not every discussion needs to turn into an AMD vs INTEL thing. :(
Why Intel can't release an immediate counter to AMD, is partially for the same reason AMD couldn't counter core architecture for over a decade. You're talking large companies with many moving parts. A new product for each means many parts of that need to be in sync. There are budgets to consider, technical and support persons to get working on a new SKUs taking feedback etc. It's a truly complicated task and for such large corporates. Doing things that seem simple to us from the outside, is anything but.
What we see is the last step of a journey that took thousands of man hours in engineering, validation, testing, packaging, planning etc.
All of this is a lot more involved and of a greater importance than "INTEL/AMD has a faster CPU than we do!". That statement isn't worth anything to either company. Does that statement have a direct consequence on the bottom line? That - unfortunately the primary question

The largest milestone for AMD - likely from their perspective - is power and profitability with Zen. That increase in AMD's measure of success for Ryzen over their previous parts is a number comprised of many factors of which performance is one, but not the most important one. Per wafer how many more CPUs can they get, what is the price of the wafer, what is the yield etc? There are literally hundreds if not thousands of these considerations.
 
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#7
If i did not own a 8600k or 8700k I would have considered buying the new zen cpu's but the price's between amd and intel currently does not justify me paying the exact same amount for a 2700X and 8700k. Gouhan Gouhan yes both companies are putting a lot of work in the development of these cpu's. but hey lets wait for some more cpu benchmarks and see what happens I am happy along as we as gamers or developers benefit from these to companies fighting for the no 1 spot!
 

Vasjh

Cannon Fodder
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#8
I am a huge AMD fan, but I don't expect a lot more from the Ryzen+ compared to Ryzen Gen1. Node shrink so more efficient, better IMC (yarrrr hopefully more than 2933Mhz)

Won't move from my Gen1 to + (*shakes fists @ RAM*) but will give Coffee Lake a better go.
Competition good, but AMD really need to shake up the GPU market. Luckily Intel is now stuck with uncle Raja.
 

CRE4MPIE

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#9
Competition drives innovation - AMD aren't competing with intel - they are merely trying to release an alternative from a cost / performance price point !
 
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#10
8700k R 5 500.00
2700X R 5 500.00

8600K R 3800.00
2600X R 3800.00

exact same pricing on these cpu's and I think they are suppose to compare performance wise?

is the 2700 and 2600 not the better buy in this situation?

2600 R 2900.00
2700 R 4450.00
 

Gouhan

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#14
But it is there, in the heading


Intel will probably release a socket 1337 Core i11 that is minutely faster than the current CPU's and uses proprietary memory that is the same speed as the current DDR4 memory.
I don't think so. Intel's answer is nothing as Ryzen isn't a relevant answer to any question they are asking. That is not the same as INTEL vs AMD, where it endcs up being speculation and nonsense. So, really don't think that is what is being spoken about, could be wrong though. If I am then my error.
 
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#15
Gouhan Gouhan I have noticed that Intel is merely in the market for the financial point of view because they do have more to offer yet they seem to do cpu releases with 20 percent improvements at a time with each Gen however that been said because AMD have moved into a much more interesting area of the market been the closest competition they've had in years now so to combat this I have heard the new Intel cpu to expect currently is focused more on editing and task power with built in sound capabilities for the sound editing section of the market..... it's not all about all out raw speed at the moment but more a question of who can do more in the quickest time whilst still been gamer friendly. I see the new Ryzen speeds but still feel they are at least 1ghz too slow for raw brute force.

Let's see what other input comes into this thread would love to see this grow with more facts when they're released.

The AMD vs Intel rivalry never hurt sales so it's all good because it just adds to their marketing of each system especially based on what each processor is focus built for.
 

Gouhan

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#16
They both are.
Planning, design, testing, execution and about a thousand other steps go into making a CPU that we can't know.
Both INTEL and AMD study what the others introduce into the market. They use plenty of data and performance profiling tools, even examine the CPUs under powerful electron microscopes for finding out how it works.
AMD has been doing this for years on end and with Ryzen; knew exactly the performance target they needed to hit or would need to hit by the time it released. It is the advantage of being #2, which INTEL as the ones who were charting the path forward, can't have. AMD literally built a CPU that wouldn't have some of the limitations that the Core architecture eventually ended up crashing into. These limitations are not anything INTEL nor anyone can do anything about. In 2004 ~ 2005, there were X number of tools with specific capabilities.
The problems you will run into come 2015 are impossible to model or see with meaningful precision and accuracy. Consider as well some decisions you may make between now and then which may introduce issues you couldn't have imagined, while others simply turned out to not be issues at all you may have made provisions for.

When AMD was working on Zen, besides their own targets and milestones for the project - they could better see all the issues with the Core design that Intel couldn't have at an earlier time. So to get to the same place as INTEL, their investment is much smaller because it's a well known path and the costly pitfalls along that path can be avoided.
The same will work for Intel as well, since they have hindsight now and the advantage of seeing how Zen works will allow them to avoid those eventually pitfalls that AMD may make since they are leading in their design in many aspects including oddly enough IPC. In 2021 I believe, INTEL has a completely new architecture, that leaves behind all things Core. Their reaction or lessons from Zen will be seen then perhaps, not right now.
 
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#17
This is Intel's current roadmap:



My question is, will they continue with the current LGA1151 socket for their S processors?

Cascade Lake-X is the next big step in 2018 Q4 but will they stick with LGA2066?

I ask all this because of upgrade paths. Have they settled on this socket format? How much longer do we have until they change?

Cheers :)
 

JollyJamma

Official Forum Dunce
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#18
So by that diagram, my Z370 chipset is good for a while but to be honest, both AMD and Intel have released CPUs of late that offer far better bang for buck than before.

Right now, both offer good options for consumers and actually, you can't really go wrong with either. You can get a lot more cores from AMD but if you want IPC optimization then Intel is the way to go.

I can't see how either are entirely stepping on each others feet other than both being CPUs but that being said, they will try to step on the others foot to get ahead.

If I was Intel and really wanted to step on AMDs turf, I'd launch cheaper CPUs and motherboards first rather than the expensive Z370 only as to offer consumers an alternative bang for buck solution over AMD. An 8700K absolutely dominates anything AMD has to offer, realistically, given most programmes ability to use all of even Threadrippers cores.

I predict Intel won't nuke the Coffee Lake stream till end of the year but they will come out with something new of Q1 2019 for consumers, excluding Cascade Lake X.
 
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#19
My Ryzen 7 2700x and Asus Crosshair VII Hero is ordered and paid for. If AMD continue this route Ill continue to support them going forward. I had a Ryzen 7 1700 and it was incredible. I take my hat off to AMD to be back. Maybe not the best but still incredible for what I paid.

Intel is great but my money is and will stay with AMD where cpu is concerned.

I am no expert so this is just my opinion.
 
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#20
JollyJamma JollyJamma I would appreciate it if Intel revised the 8700k into a better chip or perhaps took something else out of a magic hat.... if they had to make a better cpu then the coffeelake series for that specific category would they then call it the Cocainelake Hardcore edition lol