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bad deal with oklaf

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johanplay

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Ok so correct me if this in in the wrong place but i believe it's in the right place.
I contacted Oklaf after getting his number in pm. we talked on watsapp then i phoned him back after a missed call from him and we got to an arrangement that i will pay him with ewallet and send courier on Wednesday (11/07/2018), so i payed him this morning (10/07/2018) i told him i payed and he said he did not receive an sms after a while he said we should leave the deal and he blocked me on watsapp. i talked with fnb today and they will try and do a refund 3-5 days. i will be attaching all watsapp and payment proof.
It seems that he is trying to scam but if not i would like him to state his side and i would like to still do the deal.
he clearly does not know how carb works.
i do have a few deals done and all were good deals compared to him who has 1 and is a new member.

Seller: @Oklaf
Buyer: @johanplay
Oklaf state your side. Oklaf profile: https://carbonite.co.za/index.php?members/oklaf.33027/
Bad deal add: [Sale] - OPEN FOR NEGOTIATION: Various Wireless Gear (Mikrotik, Ubiquity etc) | Networking and internet
 
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i will attach a bank statement if necessary
 

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@Oklaf please state your side. I am going to give this slightly longer to resolve since you have a good iTrader at least.

@johanplay, can you try calling him from a different phone and let him know of this thread? I see he doesn't come online all that often.
 
i tried phoning with private number but not anwsering. like someone pm'd me now you can do *120*277# from your phone to see ewallet. the problem is i phoned fnb and they told me the same thing so i sent him a voice note on watsapp you can see it in the last screenshots i posted but he blocked me i then tried phoning and he blocked me on calls again so yea i phoned and asked fnb to see if they can refund
 
Ok. Lets sum up the facts.

I Have been scammed more than enough times in my life to know how to recognize a scam if I see it. Actually it is the reason why I'm selling my stuff and moving overseas, its to get away from all the corruption in SA.

Symptoms of a scam:
1) Person has no identifiable whatsapp picture to avoid being identified.
2) Person is usually unable to collect the purchase goods themselves due to money issues, but they seem to somehow have enough money to pay someone to collect.
3) They tend to send falsified messages that only come from their own number and not from any official source.
4) They give you conflicting info that does not tie up.
5) They usually only want to do the payment shortly before the collection in the hope the payment delay excuse will count in their favor.

This deal held true to all the above mentioned aspects.

1) I Told Johan I would have my wedding yesterday and would not have time to attend to the matter. Toxxyc i'm willing to send you the marriage certificate in private since I will not post such personal info on the internet. I can also send you the username of my friend on carbonite who can confirm this. That is why I did not answer the phone yesterday.

2) There is a very good reason why I state on my ads that I only accept Hard cash...Its its to avoid issues like this. I only accepted eWallet because you insisted on EFT which I do not trust. and still felt I wanted to help you.

3) When you do an eWallet payment the pin is only valid for 30min. Johan confirmed this as well and used this as a reason not to do the payment on Monday night, despite this If you look at the messages you will see the time when the payment was done is 6:17am this is well after the time we first communicated yesterday. Therefore even if I did get the message in time I would not have been able to get to an ATM on such short notice. Yet despite this Johan did not understand this and did not want to resend the pin, which he should have also received on his browser when he requested the payment. Why was Johan unwilling to send me this pin?

4) I Did a test ewallet payment myself yesterday to check the entire procedure, not once did FNB send me a message in the format Johan sent me for the deductions.

5) Anybody can fake digital media a couple of whatsapps does not prove you sent it.

6) I offered Johan to come in person and have a look at the gear I have available, why would I do this If i'm a scam?

7) How do I know Johan did not go to an ATM himself and draw the money?

8) I don't have many positive ratings yet, but that does not make me a fraud. I can refer you to people I have done business with on carb for reference.

9) What Johan did also not respond to my my request to resend the pin. As per the attached photo the option does exist. If Johan did not draw the money himself and really intended for me to get the money, why did he not just click on the button to resend the payment. There would have been no risk to him doing this at all, yet he did not comply with my request. Why?

So here is my thought... If there was truly a delay due to FNB then they would have only reserved the funds and have reversed it by now. in which case Johan would receive his money back. If Johan did go to an ATM and draw the money himself with the pin supplied on his browser then he has the money anyway. So the savest option for me was to stop paying attention to the deal and protect myself.

Carbonite states that you should be careful of scammers. This is exactly what I did and now I am the one being blamed for protecting myself.
I Will try and contact FNB myself with the supplied reference numbers and find out if what Johan said is true.

I Recommend Johan to keep an eye on his bank statements. he will see there was no money deducted.
 

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Johan if you are willing to keep an eye on your statements you will see the money was either not deducted, or if it was then it must have been reversed by now. If you are willing to confirm this and resend me a valid pin so I can draw the money I would still be willing to supply you. But sorry I need to protect myself first.
 
i did not have a pin as i ticked the send pin to you optoin that gives you the power to withdraw anytime and request a new pin if needed. thats why i told you i can't give you a new pin as it does not allow me to. also why do i need a picture of myself on my watsapp my child is my pp no need to explain it to you. also i have not sent a courier yet and you could of sorted it out later insted of blocking me. i have done a few deals on carb and would say that i can be trusted i even have a guy on carb that's still paying me back money for a faulty product i bought last year april and he pays as he has the cash to. your actions was of a scammer in my point of view. i'm still willing to do the sale if fnb refunds my money and use an OP as midel man for payment
 
@Oklaf I understand you are HIGHLY cautious, and I applaud you for it. It is because of people like you that scammers sometimes have a hard time - bravo!

On that same note though, you should note that @johanplay has 14 positive iTraders. I must point out that, while this does not making him a Carbonite overlord, he does have some sort of credibility here. I think you should give him some sort of benefit here.

On the third part, I must add that these eWallet payments are TERRIBLE, for all the reasons listed above. They're terrible to work with and cause headaches everywhere. If someone sends you an EFT from FNB, you can go to FNB's website and they will verify the payment for you, even long before the money actually clears in your account. EFTs aren't an easy method to scam anymore, unless you really are blind, and neither of you seem to be unseeing in this matter.

As a final comment here - I am firmly of the belief that neither of you two are trying to scam each other here. johanplay wants that stuff and you want to sell it. Unblock him on WhatsApp and see if we can sort this out?
 
i do not have to explain my money situation to anyone but i will. about 4years ago the company i worked for closed down and did not pay my last month salary i was married to my wife of almost 6years now and we had no other income. i started my own IT company doing repairs websites etc. (citech.co.za) (still running in the background very slowly) i did it for a year not having a steady income sometimes less than 4k a month. in that time my car broke and its still broke. then i got a job with a 6k salary pm and took it cause i had no funds to continue on my own at that time we moved in with my mother in law as we could not afford a place and her father had cancer. he passed about 2 years ago and i have been providing for my mother in law myself and my wife ever since. i started building on my company with the little money i had and got a few paying clients. then my wife got pregnant and we had a boy now 9 month's and my business growing money went to him. i only got a better paying job 2month's ago and things are starting to look up again. so sorry i i'm not rolling in the cash and i don't have a car to collect. not all of use have money to leave SA. some of us just have to bite the dust
 
Sorry Johan. I Did not intend to become personal with the profile picture. And sorry for your situation.
For now I would please like to keep the conversation on the forum for record purposes.
I Respect your positive rating on the Carbonite site as well as your efforts to make something of yourself, but still I can not supply the products if I did not receive the money.

I suggest the following to restore credibility:
There does exist the possibility that due to the fact that the transaction is of a higher value FNB could have locked your funds..
Please give a day or two and you will see the money will be in your account.
When this happens please inform me on this thread, and then we can renegotiate the sell and hopefully restart on a good foot.
I believe time will show you I did not lie. it wont be fair to draw any conclusions before then.
Alternatively Johan if you prefer please log into your FNB account, Go to Send Money > To eWallet > History. Then under the ewallet trasaction please click on the "Send Again" button.
Both these options can resolve the issue.
 
already requested a refund after 10min on the phone with fnb. when the money is back i will let you know and we can maybe try again
 
Proof from FNB the payment notification Johan sent me can not be verified on their site.
You are more than welcome to check yourself at
Online Banking
 

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FNB has no means to see I blocked you on Whatsapp.
 
How do they revers money which has apparently been drawn from an ATM?
 
dude. really i phoned fnb after you blocked me. sat on the phone with them for 10min and they blocked the funds and set it to refund. must i request the voice recording from them for you?
 
The fact that you say the funds where blocked means you know the funds where not withdrawn.
 
Well I think that resolves our issue then. You just admitted the funds are frozen in your account.
.
 
I Just spoke to FNB.
They admitted to having problems with their system.
They did notify me telling me Johan called in to block the funds.
Johan due to the fact that FNB has spoken to you and confirmed that the funds have not been withdrawn and has been locked for reversal, can you please accept that I did not try to scam you.
I Will accept the fact that FNB had system issues and was unable to send me the pin.
 
I am willing to let this thing go on the grounds of FNB admitting they had system issues.
Johan I please ask you remove the insulting posts from my selling threads.with the current new knowladge at hand it is obvious neither of us where trying to scam one another.
 
I am willing to let this thing go on the grounds of FNB admitting they had system issues.
Johan I please ask you remove the insulting posts from my selling threads.with the current new knowladge at hand it is obvious neither of us where trying to scam one another.
I already removed it
 
Thanks ViVception

Johan I still need to sell the gear. Do you still want to continue with the deal?
 
Just a heads up you have an address saved in the first batch of uploaded pics which you might want to remove....
 
Thanks guys.

I Hope everyone is happy now.
Johan please let me know if you are still willing to continue with the deal.
I have unblocked you on my phone, sorry for all the issues, I was just protecting myself.
 
yes i will like to continue i'm just waiting for the refund to show as i don't have the cash to pay again. my phone is flat will contact you
 
thanks for everyone's help and sorry for any in convenience caused. will update if necessary but hope not. i think oklaf might of had the wedding jitters and ran away from the carb deal instead of the wedding deal lol. thx again to all OP's. toxxic i still have to stick you for a beer someday will chat.
 
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